OOC Town Hall, System Announcement

Whirlpool says, “say I'm sure everyone will have questions! We've got a lot to go over, and a lot of things I want to talk about. AS you all know, we're preparing the move to Ares. This is not our first time rebooting, or even to some etent recoding, our game. We've made transfers before, though never one quite this large. Jumping from MUX to Ares is a considerable change, but it's also giving us time to evaluate the current status quo and waht is and isn't working. We've always sought to update our themes, to continually Do Better and revise what is and isn't working about it. Mael was, in fact, pretty notorioius for this. ;) A lot has changed since our last major reboot, and frankly, in view of all the real life things we've learned since then about ourselves and our RL experiences, we'd be remiss if we didn't take the chance to evolve our theme to one better suited for the future.”

Mikilos says, “....cyberpunk?”

Raethon says, “nice try, Mik.”

Delilah says, “Star Trek?”

Elleandra says, “It's a Lord of the Rings Steampunk game, Mikilos.”

Mikilos just wants pastel colors, be they ponies or giant mohawks.

Whirlpool says, “>.<!”

Derecho says, “THere's more, y'all. XD”

Whirlpool says, “Don't make me turn this car around and reboot us into My Little Pony MUSH!”

Elleandra says, “Waiting for the big reveal!”

You say, “No.”

Derecho says, “Let the man speak from his notes. XD”

Faranmidahn says, “Brae can have her hooves again”

Raethon bonkbonkbonks Elle, Mik and Delilah.

Mikilos hehs.

Cryosanthia says, "No, you don't want to do that."

Derecho says, “GUYS. Guys guys. Chill a sec, this is gonna take a bit to avoid being a brick.”

Derecho says, “Let the man talk.”

You say, “Agreed. There is a lot of information to discuss, if we devolve into jokes over every comment, we'll never get it all out.”

Whirlpool laughs and laughs. Right. Okay. :) MOVING ON.

Whirlpool says, “So lemme start with the big news.”

Whirlpool says, “After a lot of thought and deliberation, which I will go into explaining shortly, I' d like to announce that staff has made the decision to follow along with Paizo and the PFS and update to Pathfinder second edition. The pace of content, updates, flexibility alongside with a healthy dose of gameplay streamlining has offered us the best solution. We considered 5th Edition stroingly as well, but Hasbro's incredibly restrictive open gaming license (one feat?! One path per class??) made that an impossibility. Staying on Pathfinder 1 seems like a dead end, especially when we have to recode everything from the ground up to begin with. With time and examination, we've come around to appreciating PF2s changes consiedrably, and we're confident that it will be a good fit, in addition to allowing people to more closely adhere to the feel of their current characters, should they choose to keep them.”

Whirlpool says, “Essentially, it was either stay the same, or update. IF we update, it was 5e or PF2. Due to the way ARES works, we can not do 5e without violating their OGL. This seems like an unhealthy risk to take.”

Merek says, “I dislike 5e greatly.”

You say, “To clarify this: we quite simply do not have the time to homebrew, playtest, and balance everything if we do 5e. I refuse to code two chargens.”

Merek says, “So at least it isn't that.”

Raethon raises hand.

Whirlpool says, “One moment, Rae. :)”

Elleandra says, “I think that's a pretty natural move, Whirlpool. I've heard the class balancing in PF2 is excellent, though I will admit I've not played it at all.”

Raethon says, “K.”

Whirlpool says, “Hey, we're all gonna be in the same boat. That's why we've got more to talk about :)”

Culix says, “I've looked into PF2 and I had mixed feelings at first but I've come around to it. It brings back some great features from older editions of D&D, like weapon and armor proficiencies. Action economy is more variable and better defined. You can begin customizing your character much earlier in the levels, and there is a definite move towards acheiving higher levels of power with a narrower focus or spreading out for versatility.”

You say, “Guys, there's more to say.”

Mikilos has played 5th, prefers PF. Has not played PF2, but have been reading over the core book. Still don't know what i'm doing.

You say, “I have set the room AUDITORIUM until Whirlpool is finished. Please hold your comments and chatter until we call.”

Whirlpool says, “I'll be opening the floor to questions shortly. I'm just striving to keep this digestible for the moment.”

Whirlpool says, “I know a lot of you will have questions on what this means for you and your characters. Those are completely natural and fair. I know there's also going to be that instinctive, grognardy switch a lot of us have in our heads that 'ugh change change is bad I am comfortable where I am!'. And I get that! Totally get that. Goodness knows that's a natural reflex to have and it is one I also share in my head, not infrequently. But, since Landslide literally taught themselves a brand new coding language to do this, I think the rest of us can tamp this down and give it a fair shot. Moreover, as the date for the conversion gets closer, we will be offering a *lot* of opportunities or all of you to help get involved in the process as well as a lot of different options for what you want to do with your characters. Your characters, their history, and their relationships are all important to you, and we want you to know that this matters to us as well.”

You say, “Not one language. Two.”

Whirlpool says, “Now, I am not saying that all characters will be able to be exactly as they are, but around 90% of characters should translate fine within the system. There are some exceptions, like we won't immediately have a replacement for artificer, but we'll be using that opportunity to redefine and center what artifice means to the world, and detail its theme more cleanly. I can confidentally say that most core and probably APG classes will be in at launch, so take the time to glance through those when you have a moment.

I also want to say that this isn't *immediate*. We're not converting tomorrow. This is all months out from now, and the plots we are running now have been in long gestation and are important. Some of you are already impacting the shape of things to come with your actions -- which brings me to another thing. You all matter. Your stories matter. The things you're doing now? They matter. And our change to Ares, and our corresponding change to how we operate and play, are all going to make those things clearer. You will have the ability to impact the new theme in ways you're not aware of yet. :)”

Whirlpool says, “All we ask is that you go into this with patience and an open mind, and bear with us as we do the things. :)”

Whirlpool says, “This is something we're hard at work on. I do want to stress, that while any character can probably make the jump, some of it will take some time and patience to get there. :)”

Whirlpool says, “We will be offering a *lot* of different paths and options. :)”

Whirlpool says, “Okay! Questions. :)”

Whirlpool says, “I am sure you all have a lot.”

You say, “Speech lock released, go ahead.”

You say, “As some of you know, I have stepped back from RP so that I can devote more time to coding. The good news is that PF2, because of the way it is constructed, is much easier to code than PF1.”

Elleandra says, “Quick one, cause I'd like clarity on the 'stuff you do now'. When you say impact in ways that people aren't aware of, can you put some rails on that? Do the impacts align with the intentions of players?”

Raethon test

You say, “Do I understand the intent of that question to be "will what we accomplish always be exactly what we want/intend to accomplish?"”

Whirlpool says, “That is going to depend on their intentions, and their ability to succeed at them. Nobody is promised to get exactly what they want, the world exists independent of them, but it *is*collaborative.”

Azog says, “Will all chars keep our classes and level when we switch over? (With exception of Artificers, who won't have a class until that is figured out?)”

Mikilos says, “I know when we made the switch to PF, did some changes to introduce new classes and races. At this point is there any intention to bring in new classes or races? Not a reskin of an old PrC under a new name, or whatever, but new core?”

Elleandra says, “Sorry, my question revolves around player agency. All actions have an impact, as in they don't occur in a vacuum. Just trying to get some understanding here of what was meant. :)”

Whirlpool says, “Agency is paramount.”

Whirlpool says, “But 'agency' and 'results' are not the same thing. :)”

Elleandra says, “I never intend to get exactly what I want. That's boring. But I love collaboration that goes beyond 'you can't do that the end' :)”

Whirlpool says, “Agency is to be respected.”

Elleandra says, “Thank you :)”

Whirlpool says, “And we're planning on doing our level best to be as open as we can about it, and one of the reasons for the setting shake up is to make it easier for players to more visibly feel they have that impact.”

Whirlpool says, “Mikilos, yes. For example, we're returning Tieflings and Aasimars to the fold.”

Elleandra gives Whirlpool +5 points for bringing back the race she /really/ wants.

Raethon has a couple of questions. One of my more pressing ones was asked by Azog (will we be able to keep our characters and levels, or in my case, ones that I want to keep).

Malik says, “Importantly, though, those are just flavors of Human in PF2E. Same as Half-Orc and Half-Elf.”

Whirlpool says, “PF2 actually opens them to any race, Malik.”

Whirlpool says, “You can be an elf tiefling, even.”

You say, “Not quite, they're part of Versatile Heritage and will be open to any ancestry, per my instructions from Whirl.”

Malik says, “Gotcha.”

Elleandra says, “I'm good with that, just want the concept of those open :)”

Merek says, “I wanna be an Aasimar.”

Whirlpool says, “Will he be named 'Merek Black'? I'm gonna guess he'll be named Merek Black the 7th. :P”

Merek says, “ouch”

Whirlpool :D

Derecho pats. Whirl was merely teasing. :3

Mikilos wants to be a wemic, but has never found a way to balance those without race levels.

Whirlpool was!

Merek says, “apologies”

Merek nods

Merek hugs

Cryosanthia hi fives Mikilos, "Me too."

Aya has a somewhat converse question, "Are characters required to migrate? This seems like an ideal opportunity to start anew if the theme/world is shifting."

Raethon says, “First question is: those classes/offshoots that aren't featured in PF2....How are we going to handle that? For example: I have two sorcerers which have bloodlines that are NOT featured in PF2, Aquatic and Verdant. Are they going to be homebrewed or done away with?”

Whirlpool says, “Aya, no. You're not required to migrate.”

Whirlpool says, “If you want to start fresh, you can, and in a lot of ways we all will.”

Whirlpool says, “Because of what's coming up IC, you'll have the option to reboot old favorites, or retire them in interesting ways. We're going to be getting more into that once the 'hows and whys' become more apparent IC.”

Whirlpool says, “Right now, we're avoiding homebrewing content, which is why we won't have immediate replacements for artificer or war golems.”

Raethon says, “And second question, I noticed in PF2 that Paladins are gone, but replaced with 'Champions', which seem to be a slight rekit of paladins, but not fully alignment locked. That going to be Rped into in time?”

Whirlpool says, “Yes, Rae.”

You say, “I'll field the paladin question.”

Culix says, “They actually have three kits, depending on alignment.”

Whirlpool nods to Land.

Raethon says, “all right. I never really played those two sorcs much anyways.”

Whirlpool says, “Go ahead.”

Whirlpool says, “It's more complicated than a 'simple yes'.”

Whirlpool says, “I'll get to levels shortly. :)”

Cryosanthia says, "Building on Aya's question, if you aren't migrating a char, can you get the levels/RPP spent on it, in something else?"

Malik says, “There is a Champion for all nine alignments, actually. The evil ones get a treatment in APG. The neutral ones are forthcoming.”

Culix says, “Liberator and... the NG one whose name I forget I know have existed as classes in the past, just not ones we've used.”

Aya needs to look at PF2. "I know nothing about it after the initial alpha way back, when it seemed universally panned. It's obviously come a long way since then."

You say, “Champions have different kits depending on the chosen alignment. Paladin is the LG kit, but there's also an NG "redeemer" and a CG "liberator", all with different rules. As Malik says, there will be neutral ones as well.”

Malik says, “Redeemer.”

Raethon listens to Landslide.

Merek says, “I'd probably try to port my guy if possible, i'd need to honestly look up pf2 though, I've never read it at all.”

Merek says, “Will we get source material on wiki like before for 'basic' stuff like class progression etc after a certain point?”

Raethon has done research....Un'eth would, and I do request, that she be ported. :D

You say, “All divine servants (clerics, paladins, a couple of others) have "Edicts" - things you must do and "Anathema" - things you will fall if you do.”

Elleandra says, “Merek, you can learn a lot about PF2 just with free online resources, in the meantime.”

You say, “That's all.”

Merek nods!

You say, “They are different per kit and per deity.”

Raethon says, “Clerics, Paladins and Druids. Those I know of, landslide.”

Raethon says, “Thank you.”

Derecho will point those that want to look up their thing to the available resources on request. :3 But this is a good point for Whirl to address what we're launching with.

Raethon nodnods.

Raethon has been doing a bit of research...hence the questions.

You say, “So we have a lot of questions rapid-fire.”

Whirlpool says, “Yeah, we're planning to launch with Core and APG at the moment, probably. :)|”

Raethon shuts up for now...questions were answered.

Whirlpool says, “Obvioously, things can change.”

You say, “The nice thing is that addition of new classes/spells/items/ancestries is much easier to do in Ares.”

Culix says, “I don't really have a question, but i do have some comments regarding how I feel about the switch up from PF to PF2 which I think might help folks who haven't looked into it very much so far appreciate what the major changes will be.”

Merek says, “Will we have alchemist at all?”

Whirlpool says, “Yes.”

Merek says, “YAY”

Culix says, “Alchemist is a core class in PF2”

Whirlpool says, “So, right now? We don't have alchemist because we turned it into Artificer.”

Whirlpool says, “WE don't intend to do that this go around.”

Merek says, “Alchemy is the best.”

Derecho says, “So, to Azog's question.”

Whirlpool says, “Yeah, sorry. Been meaning to get to that.”

Raethon says, “OH...that leads to another question. I'll wait.”

Culix says, “At first blush, when looking at a class in PF2, it looks as though they have lost a lot of their abilities. But the way that PF2 is laid out, there is just a great deal more customization at every single level, right from level 1. Many previously automatic class features are now class feats, and feats are handed out at a much greater rate, so you can pick and chose exactly which class features you want for your character. There's much less single level dipping and the like needed in order to get a character with just the right balance of abilities to fit you.”

Whirlpool says, “Culix! Yes! That's one of the things I really like about it. I know some people feel 'I have to pay a bunch to get what I already had in PF', but in reality, it's just much more versatile and allows for stronger character variety. For a game with a ton of different characters, that's HUGE.”

Whirlpool says, “The less two PCS automatically resemble each other for sharing a class, the better.”

Derecho tugs Whirl back to levels. XD

Whirlpool is getting ther. xD

Merek says, “What about alignment?”

Merek says, “Only Good/Neutral?”

Whirlpool says, “Merek, lemme put a pin in that and I'll get back to it.”

Merek nods.

Whirlpool says, “I have to address levels first :)”

Raethon says, “yes. Levels first.”

Cryosanthia has a block of text she'd like to post at some point.

Whirlpool says, “We're not fully prepared to talk about this because the options for characters aren't fully fleshed out yet, and I can't talk about other options yet because they'd literally be plot-spoilers. The answer is a short-term no, with a qualified longer-term yes. With patience, 'yes', in the immediate short-term, 'no'. I don't think anyyone is well served by us trying t4o jump into running level 15 PF2. Plus, the reboot is a good time to onboard new players (which we'll probably get in some amount).”

Whirlpool says, “cryo, is this a question? :)”

Whirlpool says, “Or is it an opinion?”

Whirlpool says, “Because questions don't usually come in the forms of blocks of text. xD”

Cryosanthia says, "It's eight to nine questions in 4 blocks of umbrella concerns that cover some of the individual things come up."

You say, “Cryosanthia, in a forum like this, it's probably best if you ask one question at a time.”

Whirlpool says, “Okay, that's a lot of questions.”

Cryosanthia keeps waiting, and typing, and they pile up.

Whirlpool says, “Yeah, I'd like one question at a time, if you don't mind!”

Whirlpool says, “No, ask your questions! Just do so individually :)”

Whirlpool says, “We need to give other people a chance to weigh in.”

Whirlpool says, “So please please ask one at a time rather than in a huge block that's gonna make myy ADD go ahhhhhhhhhhhhh xD”

Raethon patpats Whirl.

Whirlpool says, “(One of the reasons I am excited to be switching to Ares is because the system will help me manage my plots/ADD better.)”

Whirlpool says, “I am happy to answer some of your questions, Cryo, just start with one, you know, and never feel bad for asking. :)”

Malik says, “It really is superior in just about every way. Something of a learning curve but just absolutely lovely.”

Cryosanthia nods, "Okay. I think you are still answering, so I'll wait on those answers."

You say, “To answer Merek's alignment question, yes, we are still limiting to good/neutral alignments at this time.”

Elleandra says, “I'd say fire your most important question into the stack, Cryo dear. :)”

Stjepan waves.

You say, “Go ahead and ask questions, but you have to ask one at a time.”

Whirlpool says, “Hi, Stjepan!”

Cryosanthia says, “I have two 'World Building' of Theme concerns that are really independent of any kind of code and rules. First, are all the lore pages on races, place, etc going to be lost? Are any of the holes there going to be filled in. Elleandra is much better on elaborating on this, but for example short of digging through Jade Island logs, if you can find them, it's very hard to tell what it's like or how a character from there should act.”

You say, “Oh gosh. Cryo.”

Maelstrom hehs

You say, “We are filling in so many holes it isn't FUNNY.”

Faranmidahn says, “Comforting. That was a question on my mind, too.”

You say, “It's not even funny how much adding/explaining/theme fixing is happening.”

Whirlpool says, “So, short term: everyone will be level 1. You can always reboot a favorite character that way in the transition, if you want. But again, that is short-term, and there will be other options you can avail yourslef of.”

Whirlpool says, “Cryo, we're expanding and re-adding theme.”

Derecho says, “We have to build them first.”

Raethon says, “Awww....I wanted to keep Durrankar at level 18. XD”

Whirlpool :P at Rae.

Whirlpool says, “I don't think any of us is well served by doing that right out the gate. :)”

Raethon says, “You know Beloved advisor and 'how the hell did I get here?' shaman. XD”

Whirlpool says, “We've had some goals.”

Whirlpool says, “A lot of those are to make cultures matter more.”

Mikilos sads, won't tower over the landscape as an archmagus... ah well. ')

Elleandra says, “We will all love you the same, Mikilos :)”

Whirlpool says, “And to prevent additional and fun ways for players to butt heads as characters, to promote the kind of interpersonal drama and conflict that matters to continuing RP.”

You say, “The short answer to your question is that lore is being revived, expanded, and tweaked.”

Whirlpool says, “Yes. :)”

Derecho says, “Making cultures matter was actually helped along by PF2, a lot.”

Elleandra says, “Excellent. :)”

Culix has started over before, doesn't mind doing it again :)

You say, “Prevent? I think you mean _present_?”

Whirlpool says, “We had received a ton of previous complaints that our lore was too 'deep' and there was 'too much'. That lead to the streamlined approach we took for PF1.”

Whirlpool :P

Whirlpool yes.

Whirlpool says, “I did not mean 'prevent'. xD”

Malik says, “Raise your hand if you still haven't read all the lore pages. *raises hand*”

Stjepan grins.

Whirlpool says, “Right?”

Elleandra read them all and took like 10 pages of notes to summarize them lol

Azog says, “So, will there be some sort of IC explanation for why level 20 characters are, for however long, roughly the same power as level 1 characters? Deblilitating plague or whatever, that we will get over whenever our old levels become appropriate/possible?”

Whirlpool says, “A lot of people don't read that because there's a LOT. So the amount of depth needs to be presented in a way that lets people go as deep as they want to.”

Whirlpool says, “Spoilers, Azog. I can't say at this time.”

Azog says, “OK”

Malik says, “There will be a reason. Yes. What that reason *is* is spoilery.”

Whirlpool says, “But if I'm saying its okay to do that, you can rest assured that there will be some logic to it. :)”

Landslide points, what Malik said.

Culix says, “Space Pirates.”

Whirlpool says, “God damn it Culix”

Whirlpool says, “Why did you have to go and tell everyone.”

Faranmidahn steals ice.

Cryosanthia says, "I see. So I'll lose current levels, my 320 RPP spend on Cryo until some unspecified time later. More a push for everyone to just start fresh.

You say, “Cryo.”

Derecho says, “Not quite.”

Whirlpool says, “Not exactly, Cryo :)”

You say, “THat's not true and it's not really fair.”

Whirlpool says, “We haven't talked about RPPs yet, but we will be doing something with those :)”

Whirlpool says, “So they won't be 'lost'.”

Stjepan was thinking -- and apologies if I've asked this before -- are we going with the PF2 APG out of the gate? There's a lot of content in the current game that isn't in the Core Book.

Whirlpool says, “YEs, that's the plan.”

Stjepan says, “I've/its”

You say, “Yes, Stjepan, you're coming in late.”

Derecho says, “If you want to port Cryo over whole cloth, it's going to need to wait a bit until we've homebrewed the structures in place to make it an equitable swap.”

Stjepan says, “Cool.”

Derecho says, “That's it.”

Malik says, “And even if it were true, it's being done out of necessity. You would lose them when this database *inevitably* dies a horrible violent death anyway.”

You say, “You'll get something back for it.”

You say, “What that looks like hasn't been ironed out yet.”

Whirlpool says, “You absolutely will. Our top priority has been 'respect the time'.”

Derecho says, “But it has been a consideration since we landed on PF2.”

Whirlpool says, “Respecting people's time is one of the most important things you can do on a MUSH.”

Whirlpool says, “Time investment *matters*.”

Cryosanthia agrees there, yes.

Derecho says, “We do not want this move to sting more than it absolutely must.”

Raethon is actually looking forward to it.

Whirlpool says, “So, no. You're not 'just going to lose it'.”

Whirlpool says, “There's going to be a *lot* of options. :)”

You say, “Whirlpool, may I bring up the alts point at this point in the discussion?”

Whirlpool says, “Yes, of course.”

Culix says, “I suppose I might be in the minority, but I've always played any RPG with a spare character sheet ready to roll if any of my characters bite it.”

Whirlpool says, “That's not a minority. :)”

Whirlpool says, “A lot of people do that. :)”

Faranmidahn coughs.

Whirlpool says, “I mean, I've played Sandy for 15 years.”

Raethon raises hand. "it's why there's a 'Raethon Rule".

Whirlpool says, “I have zero plans to bring her mover.”

Culix says, “So starting over has never really bothered me as much.”

Landslide puts on coder hat, clears throat.

You say, “There will be strictures on alt creation on Ares. Because of the way Ares handles logs and scenes, I cannot delete a character object once it has participated in a scene.”

Whirlpool says, “So any character you make is here foreeeeveeeer.”

Raethon says, “So no deleting the character if it doesn't work out?”

Boshter says, “Not anymore, no.”

You say, “I can delete the sheet objects and ancillary stuff, but not the character object itself. For this reason, to avoid DB bloat, I will be imposing restrictions on how many alts you can create, and how often.”

Boshter says, “I'm on board with that until we have some clearer ideas of what's going on. :)”

Boshter says, “But it's Land's call. <3”

You say, “You can retire an alt and create another, but I will put the kibosh on creating five or six at once.”

Boshter says, “Yeaaah.”

Boshter says, “'The Raethon Rule'.”

Derecho says, “Whirl, you're on the wrong window. XD”

Boshter LOOKS AT RAE>

Faranmidahn shiftyeyes.

BoshterOH HEY I AM

Whirlpool OOP

Whirlpool boots him outta here.

Derecho says, “Speaking of alt confusion... XD”

Cryosanthia says, "Okay, I understand the Lore answer to be that it was too deep, too hard to read, but it will be re-organized into a manner that is easier to chunk, and in the process some holes will be filled in. And it's mostly moving over as-is, possibly subject to player actions to re-write it, like we all Nuke Charn or something. Is this correct?"

Derecho says, “Charn will not be nuked.”

Whirlpool says, “That seems unlikely, yes. xD”

You say, “But, player actions will drive some of the changes.”

Whirlpool nods. :)

Derecho says, “And as for the rest... we'll go with 'close enough.'”

Whirlpool says, “And that depth is uneven. Our goal is to provide more depth where it's absent.”

Raethon smirks at Whirl. "I knew that was coming."

Whirlpool says, “And reintroduce things that were set aside.”

Derecho says, “And make everything more coherent as a whole.”

Whirlpool says, “Indeed.”

Mikilos says, “Any specific changes intended to the grid? What sort of hangouts are around, how the map works, etc?”

Whirlpool says, “Grids work different on ARES.”

Whirlpool says, “I'll leave it to Land to field that one.”

Cryosanthia says, "A oh. on grid map."

Whirlpool says, “But yes, there are going to be other changes.”

Whirlpool says, “That shouldn't come as a surprise from me, given that I've run arcs that take place across the world. In fact, our long term goal is to open up more of the world to play.”

You say, “Whirlpool, what level of discussion of grids in Ares would you like?”

Culix says, “It's about time for me to sneak out. Like I said, I don't really have any questions that are on-topic. I have lots of general wonderings on lore, but I feel they will come together in time. But as for hangouts, I vote a cool abandoned warehouse or storm drain for us grimy underworld types.”

Whirlpool says, “Since nobody here is especially familiar with Ares as far as I know, the basics is good.”

Faranmidahn says, “I am.”

You say, “All right. We'll keep this basic. Grids exist in Ares, but the idea that a scene has to be in a room, and only one scene can be in that room at a time is simply no longer true.”

Whirlpool says, “But, yeah. Previous arcs have taken place in Sendor where the PCs were a resistance in Vinas Solmnus for a year, and in Dun Mordren, where the PCs helped prevent a coup, and in RUne, for the whole Rune-War arc.”

Culix has vague recollection of mecha fights in Bludgun.

Whirlpool says, “So expect more of that, and with good reason. That's all I can say without spoilers.”

You say, “I cannot say too much about the grid without giving spoilers, but remember that grid no longer equates to scenes. Scenes are abstracted.”

Culix says, “Ares basically makes everywhere a Plot room, then?”

You say, “More or less, yes, although you can declare a scene is in a grid room and it grabs the description.”

You say, “Without locking that room up.”

Culix says, “Pretty cool.”

Mikilos thinks understands, will have to fiddle with it to truly grasp.

You say, “Meltdown and I are familiar with the system, and I believe that Faran is as well. We'll teach.”

Aya says, “So there is no more grid exploring, nor happenstance RP?”

Whirlpool says, “There is.”

Whirlpool says, “That can still happen.”

You say, “It can!”

Azog says, “So our grid hasn't seen regular use since 2010. When I first played here in 2003, almost everyone hung out on the grid and RP happened where people were. When I came back in 2012, everyone was in the OOC room and RP happened like playdates.”

Culix says, “I think it's more just that if someone is already RPing a picnic by the river and you want to RP a sahaugin attack there, you can do so without disturbing them.”

Whirlpool says, “That's something that's largely been replicated across the MU* sphere, tbh, Azog.”

Derecho says, “Was that a question, Azog?”

You say, “I can throw out on channel "hey, open scene in blank room, join scene <number>", and anyone who wants tags in.”

Faranmidahn says, “I am.” Aya nods to Azog. "I was going to caveat that random social RP was not much of an occurrence lately, anyhow."

Azog is asking what the grid usage will be? Or will everyone hang out in the OOC room all the time?

Cryosanthia rephrases it as a question, "Will staff be on grid more running things, or encouraging PCs to be on grid, ie: like the 'connected' reward only happening for those in scenes, and not simply idling to scoop it up?"

Culix says, “Yeah, Azog that's pretty much standard practice on MUs these days. But even on MUs where people hang out on grid more often, it's as often as not in private rooms and apartments and such, so it doesn't make a huge difference.”

You say, “My experience with Ares is that pages and an RP Requests channel gets you RP for the asking. I can generally find it when I want it.”

Culix says, “I think idling in the OOC room is more productive than idling in a dozen separate grid rooms because you can at least chat or arrange scenes with folks while all idling in one space together.”

You say, “Ares will take that one step further.”

Faranmidahn says, “Not really.”

You say, “I will be redirecting all chat in the OOC room to the Chat channel for global discussion. There's also a Discord bot with a webhook that lets me punt that to Discord, too.”

Whirlpool says, “Yeah, Ares has interaction with discord.”

Culix says, “That's pretty cool.”

Whirlpool says, “It really is.”

Elleandra says, “The playdates thing is inevitable. Many of us are a lot older than we were in the hey day of 'wandering RP'. :)”

Raethon is glad he set it up now.

Cryosanthia echoes Culix.

Elleandra errs, inevitable.

Whirlpool says, “And on Ares, you will be able to see the ongoing scenes, and if they're open for joins too :)”

You say, “I'm setting up a separate Discord for it, Raethon.”

Whirlpool nods. There's programmings that need to happen, so when we launch, we will be launching a shiny new discord with it :)

Raethon says, “Ahhh....so I could bring the other one down when it's launched?”

Culix says, “Nice, I've seen a couple of MUSHes which have something like that, a command where you can see where RP is happening. Or at least, where there are non-idle players in public spaces.”

You say, “Yes, Raethon.”

Raethon nodnods.

You say, “For security reasons, I have to control the server if I control the bot.”

Culix says, “And yeah, the MUSH community is an aging one. Most of us have families and jobs and all sorts of real life commitments these days, so arranging RP tends to work out better than when we were idle teenagers and could just hang out online for half the day waiting to run into someone.”

You say, “The bot has access to the Ares engine.”

Raethon says, “Darn. I liked having the power to punt you off the discord and banhammer you if I didn't like your face.”

Culix says, “Anyway! I should have gone to bed an hour ago. Goodnight, folks.”

Raethon laughs a bit as he grinds the chat to a halt. XD

You say, “I know, and I'm sorry. We really do appreciate you launching it. Good night!”

Raethon says, “Nini Culix.”

You say, “It's just that I need control to protect the Ares engine and set up the webhooks.”

You say, “Cryo, did you have more questions?”

Raethon says, “Landslide, I'm full of crap. I launched it cuz I had gotten away from facebook and thought it was a good way to communicate if the game went down again.”

Landslide laughs.

Cryosanthia nods, "Okay, my second 'worldstuff' question relates to some existing 'homebrew' decisions, such as don't have this or that feat / enchant, no evil chars, etc. The lack of leadership feats / followers was a thing I remember being raised, too. No player authority in an organization. Only one AC because too many actions for one player was raised last meeting, and isn't changing, as I understand. This ties in with some observations on Reputation that came up last time, etc. There's a whole host of 'related stuffs'. I'm not advocating for catfolk, you answered the evil chars, but are those sorts of 'well we had a problem player once, so no' decisions going to be revisited? There's a bunch of those 'little' things here and there which cover things added removed from PF, if you're going with PF2 core, everything in will be in?

Derecho says, “It worked!”

Landslide lets Whirlpool field that. Leadership and followers is a different system in PF2.

Whirlpool says, “Leadership and orgs work differently in PF2.”

Raethon says, “Thaaaat leads me to a new question. I'll wait.”

Whirlpool says, “There is no 'leadership feat'. 'Summons bloat' is reduced mechanically by requiring one of your actions to direct a summon (which solves the action economy/time sink issue for summons directly). Action economy improvements are *huge* in PF2.”

Whirlpool says, “It's one of the reasons we're liking it. The action economy is *vastly* better, and that will help move things along at a faster pace even for concepts that tend to wind up hogging time.” You say, “Similar with AC and familiars. Familiars do get combat actions (that's a correction and we're going to go with the PF2 rule), but you must spend your own actions to direct minions, which both AC's and familiars are.”

Whirlpool says, “We're going to have a reputation system. :)”

Aya fears.

Ferrah raises a hand, for an off topic question.

Whirlpool says, “Ask away. :)”

Ferrah says, “How are you handling the classes that aren't in PF2 yet?”

Ferrah dunno if that's been asked yet.

You say, “It had.”

You say, “We are opening with PF2 core and APG, and the classes that are not yet in those two will not be available at launch.”

Whirlpool says, “We're launching with all APG and Core classes at the moment, Ferrah. that's the plan. You can either wait for those classes to be added in PF2, or ... yeah. :)”

Whirlpool says, “We will eventually add more.”

Raethon says, “OH....I had forgotten about this.”

Whirlpool says, “And ease of coding will help make that an easier process in PF2.”

Raethon says, “Whirl...what about the Gunslinger and the...other class that I'm flaking on?”

Whirlpool says, “Magus?”

Raethon says, “yes.”

Derecho says, “Inventor.”

Whirlpool says, “And Inventor.”

Whirlpool says, “They're all coming and we will look at them and add them in time.”

Stjepan says, “Oh -- does that include the archetype feats for multiclassing as being in?”

Whirlpool says, “Inventor is going to be useful for artifice.”

Raethon thumbs up.

Whirlpool says, “Yes, Stjepan.”

Whirlpool says, “That's core content now.”

Derecho says, “Gunslinger and Inventor are still in playtest, their splatbook isn't even done yet.”

Stjepan says, “Cool.”

Ferrah says, “So are we making brand new characters or are we expected to change class if we're one of the strange hybrid classes when we move over?”

Whirlpool says, “That's up to you. :)”

Whirlpool says, “We are gonna have options for you.”

Whirlpool says, “Waiting is always an option.”

You say, “Cryo, next question.”

Whirlpool nods! Ask :)

Whirlpool says, “Yeah.”

Whirlpool says, “As for inventor, in the interests of thematic balance, we're going to tamping down the fringe-wackylolsplodyness of artifice.”

Whirlpool says, “We need to recenter how we actually view it.”

Mikilos says, “To be clear, any planned changes for rent, lifestyle, day jobs, mundane ammo and such things currently mostly handwaved?”

Azog was going to ask about waiting. If we can hold off on recreating, will there be some marker or system that will keep track of who we had here, for conversion? Or like a voucher for a orc fighter 17?

Whirlpool says, “Yes, Azog.”

Whirlpool says, “This DB is going nowhere.”

Cryosanthia says, "This is a PF2 question, which I suppose I could research myself or watch more reviews of the system. As a GM. Concerned that it won't be easier. I've read some review that say PF2 requires a couple additional hours of monster building to set up a scene. Not sure if they were comparing to PF, 5e, what. Also concerned with three actions on each ini and wondering what the code for combat will look like. It sounds as if each round is more fiddly, more actions, which means a lot more back and forth in text.

Landslide fields this one.

You say, “Azog - this DB is showing signs of corruption.”

Whirlpool says, “Yeah, that's also true.”

Whirlpool says, “So I should rephrase”

You say, “We need to get off of it and we need to do it soon. You missed the first town hall where we talked about this.”

Whirlpool nodnods.

You say, “I am setting aside all RP and working flat out to have the chargen done as quickly as I can.”

Elleandra says, “Azog, did you mean hold off as in when the new system comes up, someone waits to create their char for a while instead of urgently porting it into the new world?”

You say, “Cryosanthia -”

Azog saw the log of the previous meeting, and I understand the DB is dying. I am asking if on the new game we will have some sort of marker that says, 'entitles bearer to one orc fighter 17' or some other way that won't require this DB stay up?

Derecho says, “Cryo, I've got your answer;”

Whirlpool says, “We will be making note of what you do with alts :)”

Whirlpool says, “And what you had here, yes.”

You say, “Go ahead, Derecho.”

Derecho says, “When we have the tools laid in, we will be running practical workshops on how to use the tools, both player-side or DM-side.”

Whirlpool says, “And a lot of those concerns have been addressed, both by experience and more. Yes, things are probably gonna be a little slower as we're learning. That's one of the reasons for the lower level start. :)”

Derecho says, “It actually streamlines things a lot more than it is now; a thing is a Reaction, or takes 1, 2, or 3 actions.”

Whirlpool says, “Practically speaking, we all have a lot to learn :)”

You say, “Combat will be a bit more coded than it is now. I will have the ability to freeze your sheet to a scene.”

Whirlpool nods to Cho!

Whirlpool says, “YEah, things like sheets and spell tracking per scene will be *immensely* easier.”

Whirlpool says, “But expect the consequences of those scenes to be more enduring too.]”

Cryosanthia nods to Derecho, "Okay, that sounds cool."

Whirlpool says, “We want you to feel teh gravity and weight of your actions more keenly.”

Elleandra says, “Question for Staff: Do you have a resource you'd recommend for newbies to PF2 as a kind of crash course or high level intro?”

You say, “We're still learning ourselves.”

You say, “I'm learning _as_ I code.”

Elleandra says, “I'll poke around and see what I can find, in that case. Thanks :)”

Whirlpool says, “So, we've seen a lot of different resources. Until we have a little more experience, I'm hesitant about recommending them.”

Aya would find plot/event scenes actually having an impact on matters a welcome change.

Whirlpool says, “I mean they do now, Aya.”

Merek says, “PF2 SRD looks nice.”

Whirlpool says, “But we want to make that more 'feelable'.”

Merek says, “For resource.”

Cryosanthia looks at Landslide, "I don't understand that answer. ... does 'freeze to a scene' mean I'm in only one scene/arc until it ends or there's a version of me frozen in that and I can do other things/scenes/arcs?

Whirlpool says, “And present.”

Whirlpool says, “No, Cryo.”

You say, “The latter, Cryo.”

Whirlpool says, “It means that you can .. right. Latter.”

You say, “Now, you will only be able to be in one combat at a time.”

Aya says, “Aftershock's huge arc bled into RP. The Dran-Rune war had an impact. Those were the ones that affected slice of life RP primarily in the past 8 years.”

You say, “But multiple scenes.”

Whirlpool nodnods.

You say, “Scenes and combats are two different things.”

Raethon knows the Dran-Rune war gave Rae PTSD ICly.

Whirlpool says, “It was fun to run :)”

You say, “What I'm calling a combat, you know as a timestop.”

Malik says, “The fact that you can easily be in four scenes at once is one of the biggest draws of Ares. That, and the fact that it auto-logs all of it so you can do it at a bit slower pace if you need.”

You say, “Exactly.”

Whirlpool nods. And that means adventures can continue throughoiut a week, instead of being locked to a particular day.

Whirlpool says, “(Though combats will probably still be scheduled.)”

Cryosanthia nods, "Oh, okay. Are... timestops going to keep you locked between parts 2, 3, 4, so you can't join another one?"

Whirlpool says, “They won't have 'parts' anymore, per say.”

You say, “Yes, so we'll need to see to it that combats resolve in a timely manner.”

Aya thinks it sounds more like tracking sheet across multiple combat scenes from separate adventures will be easier as changes in one will not affect the other.

You say, “Yes.”

You say, “But a combat and a scene are two different things.”

Aya nods.

You say, “Scenes can be tied to plots.”

Elleandra says, “Will these questions/answers be summarized somewhere for those who aren't here or those of us with awful memories?”

Whirlpool Sec.

Cryosanthia has a log.

Whirlpool says, “We're getting a little muddled :)”

You say, “Yes, I've lost track of who still has questions.”

Whirlpool says, “So, in Ares, you can be in as many social scenes as you want.”

Whirlpool says, “And can handle.”

Whirlpool says, “And those scenes can move at whatever pace involved people want. Scenes across timezones are WAY easier.”

Whirlpool says, “You're pingede when someone has posed and told it's your turn and so on.”

You say, “Yes. Ares has the concept of "async" RP.”

Whirlpool nods!

Whirlpool says, “Now, if a scene is open and wide, it's probably moving in 'real time'.”

Azog says, “That's like play by email. ;.;”

Whirlpool says, “It's just an option, Azog.”

Cryosanthia says, "That sounds nice... oh I hope not."

Whirlpool says, “Not all RP will be like that.”

Whirlpool says, “It IS nice.”

Whirlpool says, “ANd it's much more respective of your time.”

Whirlpool says, “You're told when it's your turn to pose, it's auto-logged, making it easier to keep track of what's going on, tighter continuities and so on.”

Cryosanthia has been in 4 PBEM games, 3 exploded and devoured all time, 1 died on the vine. Of the exploding ones, friends were lost each time, and one relationship.

Whirlpool says, “And the level of openness of your scenes is also within your control.”

Whirlpool says, “ARES empowers people a lot. :)”

Faranmidahn says, “"It will also tell you if you're registered alts have activity”

Whirlpool nods. Yep.

You say, “We're getting sidetracked a little.”

Whirlpool says, “We are.”

Whirlpool says, “Now.”

Malik says, “'Withering away due to lack of activity' has not been a problem in any Ares game so far. Most of them are rather flourishing under the less restrictive time constraints and new tools.”

Landslide nods. "I also recommend this."

Whirlpool nods.

You say, “Now, back to systems. Raethon, you had some questions.”

Raethon says, “and I promptly forgot. XD”

Whirlpool laughs.

Raethon says, “Go ahead. if I remember, I'll raise my hand.”

Whirlpool says, “Okay.”

Whirlpool says, “Cryo, more questions? :)”

Whirlpool says, “Elle, we'll probably try to do a TLDR version. xD”

Raethon raises hand. remembers.

Cryosanthia says, "Are buildings, locations, similar to players such that if they appear they can't be deleted, and will concern for DB bloat mean that buildings/vehicles things will be less available than they are here/ about as available/ or more freely available?"

Elleandra nods to Whirl, "I think a very short summary could cover the heart and soul of everything." :)

You say, “No, Cryo.”

You say, “As for whether everybody gets their own personal building or vehicle...”

Malik says, “There is legitimately less need for permanent buildings in Ares as you can literally set a scene anyplace you want to set it. Every scene gets its own sort of Temproom.”

You say, “Correct. There isn't a restriction, but there really isn't a need.”

Malik says, “You can start a scene in the room you're in with a simple scene/start, which assigns it a scene number and the desc of that room.”

Malik says, “Or you can: scene/start [<area>/]<location name>=<private/open>”

Malik says, “Which sets it wherever you want it set.”

Raethon blinkblink......

Cryosanthia nods, "Seems like some of my questions could be answered by looking at Ares, although my first glance brought up another. There's a 'log block' I put in front of all my uploaded logs, which was taken off the TB template somewhere. is there some altered version of that, more compatible with +scene I should start using now."

Malik says, “And you can desc it like any other room”

You say, “Cryo, go look at Ares and you'll see.”

You say, “You'll see it for yourself.”

Malik says, “Logs are all standardized per game, and include (usually) room desc, scene title, cast list, poses, and rolls.”

You say, “There's also summary, related scenes, related plots, etc.”

Malik says, “Yes, thank you!”

You say, “You can relate scenes together, you can relate them to plots.”

Malik says, “The amount of manual labor involved in logging is rather minimal.”

Malik says, “It's just a few form fields.”

You say, “Certainly far, far less than what there is today.”

Malik says, “And much less complex. No wiki formatting necessary.”

Raethon says, “if Aresmush is what I'm thinking....I might have experience with it.”

Whirlpool nods. Like, If you RP a socail scene that relates to a plot arc being run, you can file it under that arc, and it will show up there. :)

Faranmidahn says, “the commands to undo a pose so you can fix it is kinda neat”

Whirlpool says, “Yep!”

Whirlpool says, “It will have pose editing features.”

Whirlpool says, “Or you can undo a whole pose. :)”

You say, “You can also edit post-completion.”

Aya tsks. "Wasteful. No one here EVER makes typos."

Whirlpool yep!

Cryosanthia says, "So there would be a point to alter the current wiki log desc on uploads now until when things move, to have an IC and OOC time, characters at the end and... summary... nowhere to make them easier to import, or there is no need?"

Whirlpool laughs.

Malik says, “They are not going to be importable.”

You say, “Cryo, they will not be imported as scene objects. The current plan is to have a category on the wiki called "archive".”

Whirlpool nods.

Whirlpool says, “WE're not junking all that's here, but they won't be able to be imported direclty. There will be an archive, though? :)”

Cryosanthia nods, "Okay. So, not lost, but also no need to try to future proof existing because it'll stay here in old format."

Malik says, “One example of an Ares log: https://spiritlakemu.com/scene/8098”

Mikilos makes sure to preserve the tale of Dexter and the Trolls...

Cryosanthia is looking over Inception, gets the idea

You say, “All. Let me be very clear.”

You say, “The mediawiki and the MU* database will be going away once we migrate.”

Elleandra says, “So make backups of any descs we want, basically. ^^”

You say, “Those will not be retained. They are extremely old, extremely unstable, and it is not fair or reasonable to ask Lolth to maintain that.”

Whirlpool says, “Yeah, we'll have an archive, so need to worry about future proofing :)”

Raethon says, “Mediawiki being....the wiki we use now, right?”

You say, “Yes.”

Raethon says, “ah okie.”

Whirlpool says, “Just do your thing. I want to be clear: this isn't happening tomorrow or next week.”

Whirlpool says, “We're months out, almost assuredly, as we still have policies to write, theme to work on, decisions to make, and story to set up.”

Raethon says, “Oh I know. Just making sure I know what's going on.”

Whirlpool says, “We're building to something here and I am looking forward to having you all be part of it.”

Raethon says, “speaking of.....this sort of leads to a question.”

Whirlpool says, “Oh?”

Raethon says, “yeah. Some of the classes that aren't in 2e. It may have been covered. But....are you guys going to be working on a theme way of them disappearing, or are they going to change into something else? For example: The Inquisitor. We have a bit of lore on inquisitors and it'd be odd for them to suddenly poof. Are you guys working on theme/lore for that, or is it spoilers?”

You say, “I do want to be clear that I will place restrictions on how far back the archives can go.”

Whirlpool says, “I can't comment on that. In a lot of cases, that won't be necessary because they're going to inevitably appear.”

You say, “We aren't keeping fifteen years of material. That's not reasonable.”

Raethon says, “You mean disappear, Whirl?”

Cryosanthia says, "I'm confused now, Whirls and Land's answers seem to contradict? Mediawiki is going to be deleted but everything is archived? As in a Manual porting to the new wiki Ares uses? A big zip file? Is there an archive example on Spiritlake I can look at? Like Directory-Files?"

Raethon says, “or were you addressing me?”

Cryosanthia says, "or, not everything..."

Whirlpool says, “That's more of us speaking in practical terms on something that hadn't been ironed out 100% cryo. :)”

Derecho says, “Raethon;”

Cryosanthia nods, "Okay, well, perhaps some Iconic logs from way back might make the cut like Kama'o's story about Why Egalrin are the way they are or Svarshan taking everyone to Am'shere might make the cut. If you want me to go look through for things I think are cool or worth saving I can brute force that."

Whirlpool says, “Cryo, I appreciate that. Some of it may or may not work as a matter of how we're changing culture/races.”

Faranmidahn says, “I know you can set scenes to private and invite, unless those features will be locked out on our implementation. But given the relative age/maturity of most of us, if the participants of a scene are alright going into deeper/darker plots than advisable for the pg13/kinda R crowd will there be a way to age-restrict logs that post? Or woud those be 'plz don't share thx bai'”

Derecho says, “The answer is 'spoilers.' We can't tell you now, but rest assured neither Inquisitors nor their lore is going poof.”

Whirlpool says, “Also true.”

You say, “Content warnings.”

Whirlpool point at Cho

Raethon thumbs up. "Okie, Cho."

Whirlpool says, “The only class related things I can say outright are heavily changing is artifice and its place in theme and prevalence.”

Raethon says, “It's why I phrased it like that. If it was spoilers, that was the answer I'd accept. :D”

Derecho says, “They just may not be a character class until Paizo remembers they existed.”

Whirlpool says, “War Golems might not make the *initial* cut since we don't have a good replacement. We're investigating.”

Raethon says, “Thank you. :D”

Whirlpool says, “WE want to avoid non-PFS sanctioned stuff, since PFS offers a good model for MU*.”

Whirlpool says, “Pathfinder Society.”

You say, “Cryo, it's a matter of what is relevant. I cannot tell you more than that without spoilers.”

Derecho says, “We are deffo not at all going to homebrew classes for probably a couple-few years, yet.”

Whirlpool says, “We're going to have a LOT of official content to get into.”

Elleandra says, “Hopefully PF2's flexibility and Paizo's desire to sell more books, everything will get covered in time. :)”

Whirlpool says, “We're also broadening our approaches to faiths and religion too. Again, more than that is getting spoilery. :)”

Aya says, “It would be difficult to balance homebrew when most are still learning the systen.”

Whirlpool says, “Correct, Aya.”

Derecho says, “Exactly.”

Whirlpool says, “We don't want to give ourselves black eyes out the gate :)”

Whirlpool says, “What I do want, and what I think is important, that people should be able to look at the PRD and say 'I want to play X', and be able to play X.”

You say, “I wish I had a clearer answer for you than that, Cryo.”

Whirlpool says, “Yeah, some of it just touches on 'spoilers' we're not ready to unveil yet. :)”

Cryosanthia says, "Well... Beagle's Sith-makar are really different from stock PF lizard-people who hate intelligence and can only build mud huts. if all that's going away I'll... have a hard time existing. I guess that means, all the custom things done to say, goblins, sith, are those going back to stock, or is answering that somewhat Spoilery?"

You say, “Spoiler.”

Stjepan has connected.

Stjepan catches up

You say, “That's a spoiler, Cryo, sorry.”

Whirlpool says, “Yeah, it's too spoilery at the moment. :)”

Whirlpool says, “And I'm not saying that I don't understand the anxiety you'll have over that.”

Whirlpool says, “So what I can offer is that the Makar of Am'shere will still exist. :)”

Whirlpool says, “But they will no longer encompass the *whole* of what Lizardfolk can be.”

Aya imagines most anything is possible considering the current plot arc. Regardless of what group happens to assemble the power of a god, or attempts to, world- if not universe-changing catastrophes are likely to ensue.

Derecho says, “Also, to editorialize for a bit;”

Raethon will be keeping Durrankar. He seemed to be the most beloved out of all of my alts. XD

Whirlpool says, “Breaking up monoliths is something PF2 does and we're following suit. :)”

Elleandra says, “I'm glad to hear that, Raethon :)”

Derecho says, “If anyone worries we'll be taking anything 'back to stock' they've not been paying attention to what we do. :3”

Whirlpool says, “Now, anything more than 'Makar will exist' is going to be spoilery, and Makar will not be the ONLY type of lizard-people presented.”

Whirlpool says, “Basically, anything that exists now is going to be looked at and touched on, and its tone adjusted to match where we're aiming.”

Aya suggests that The Event (for lack of a better term), ignites the draconic blood in the Sith-makar, making them all true dragons, repopulating the skies like in the Age of Wonder...

Whirlpool says, “It's also important that things be accessible.”

Whirlpool :P Aya

Cryosanthia adds that to her list of things to do, after the plane-hopping house.

Whirlpool says, “Our expectations are for things to be a bit more grounded. We're not tossing high fantasy away, but we're shaving away the wackylolrandom stuff.”

Aya grins.

Whirlpool says, “Like I said earlier. Weight. Gravity. Challenge.”

Mikilos scarps his idea for a sorcerer clown-bloodline...

Whirlpool says, “Mikilos, I will put you in the bin.”

Whirlpool says, “I WILL.”

Raethon says, “You mean compared to Durrankar panicking that he MIGHT have to kill a Solar Angel if a dispel magic doesn't work?”

Faranmidahn holds out hope for the jellyfish blood bloodrager.

Raethon says, “What has more weight than THAT?”

You say, “We've come to find that the wacky-lol-random stuff that has crept into the theme over the years disrupts the ability to really tell a good story.”

Derecho says, “People get more fixed on their bits, than the story.”

Whirlpool says, “It's true.”

Mikilos nods.

Whirlpool says, “We want you all to be empowered to help tell this story too :)”

Raethon says, “Look at the trope that is Sandy.....”

Whirlpool says, “Yep!”

Faranmidahn says, “She's very hip.”

Whirlpool says, “I love her, and I've never minded her being the butt of the joke.”

You say, “But when the trop is the story, the story loses.”

Cryosanthia says, "I am not sure I can dial any further back than Christopher Moore or Terry Pratchet."

You say, “Trope, I am sorry.”

Whirlpool says, “I getcha, Cryo.”

Elleandra says, “Question for staff: How can players help? Or is there no need for any assistance at this point?”

Whirlpool says, “I am sure you will be fine. :)”

Whirlpool says, “There will be opportunities to help!”

You say, “I do need assistance, but it is a particular kind of assistance that requires an eye for detail.”

Mikilos says, “As silly as real headlines have been recently, I'm sure a middle ground can be found”

You say, “IT experience is very helpful.”

Derecho says, “Aside from Land's needs, not at the moment, Elle, but we have plans for player-sourcing projects. :3”

Whirlpool nods.

Elleandra says, “I plan on rolling up a char in PF2, so I can at least know /that/ much. :)”

Whirlpool says, “Lemme put it this way”

Malik says, “I personally prefer something more Tolkien-esque in fantasy, which I think is the general goal right now.”

Whirlpool says, “For CG, my roommate *points at Ferrah*, built her character in PF2 within five to ten minutes.”

Whirlpool says, “It should be very quick!”

Malik says, “PF2 is legit one of the easiest chargens I have ever seen. And still incredibly versatile.”

You say, “No joke.”

Whirlpool says, “Yes, harkening back to some of the epic, Tolkienesque tones we've let slide over time, of grandeur and past and history, is something we're hoping to reinvoke.”

Mikilos has tried a couple PF2 chargen systems, had only minor hiccups.

Whirlpool says, “You're all more than welcome to experiment with the various apps and building your chars in PF2. Obviously, we're starting at level 1 like we said earlier.”

Whirlpool says, “But looking at the future is always helpful!”

Derecho says, “Also.”

Raethon needs to find an app then...to practice. XD

Derecho says, “We will be staging playtests.”

Whirlpool nods. We will.

Whirlpool says, “We've got a lot to learn.”

Whirlpool says, “What I'd like to stress is that rushing to youtube for your Grognard PF2 reviews is probably *not* the best way to get a feel for the system. Youtube reviews are aimed at hate dollars. xD”

Whirlpool says, “There are some excellent podcasts out there.”

Malik says, “Pathbuilder.”

Malik says, “Pathhbuilder has a PF2 app. It's free. It's fun. Try it.”

Whirlpool ah! There we go.

Stjepan says, “Oh neat.”

Raethon says, “Where is it?”

Raethon says, “Link please?”

Malik says, “One thing you magic types will like: Cantrips are good. they are *always* good. and they scale all the way up 20.”

Whirlpool says, “Yes!”

Azog says, “Erg, is this gonna be another game where non-magic characters will be snoozing while the magic people do everything?”

<OOC> Malik https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.redrazors.pathbuilder2e&hl=en_US&gl=US

Whirlpool says, “Naw, Azog.”

Ferrah used https://herolab.online to make her character. "Sure you have to create a login, but the demo allows you to make a level 1 character, and you can play around with the character generator to get a feel for it.

Whirlpool says, “Melee does pretty well, so Grimface Sourfangs the Orc will still do what you want him to. ;)”

Elleandra says, “Azog, balance in PF2 is vastly better than PF1.”

Malik says, “Azog: Martial characters are all sorts of dope in PF2. Also, every character in PF2 can cast spells, so.”

Faranmidahn says, “Everyone casts spells?”

Azog says, “That's good, then. Wait, what?”

Cryosanthia says, "Hmm. That might fix the world a little."

Malik says, “Yeah. Every class can get a few Focus spells.”

Azog doesn't want to cast spells.

Malik says, “Then use your Focus points on other things and stop being a negative nancy. :P”

Azog isn't being a negative nancy, I'm expressing a preference based on the statement that everyone will be casting spells. If there's an alternative, that's fine.

Whirlpool says, “'Focus spells' are a thing, though. Think of them more as techniques. :)”

Mikilos says, “Everyone has the option to learn to cast spells.”

Whirlpool nods.

Cryosanthia says, "Mini-feats?"

Derecho says, “Feat feats.”

Azog says, “Option is fine, as long as it's not mandatory, or debilitating if I don't want to.”

Whirlpool says, “FEAAAATSES”

Faranmidahn says, “So, when the wizard starts hoity-toitying it over knowing spells, you can slap his gums with your dancing candle flamegirl cantrip”

Malik says, “So many feats.”

Derecho says, “And no, Azog, it's not mandatory.”

Merek says, “Makes me think of Feats vs. Techniques in 5e.”

Stjepan perceives that everything is feats ;)

Malik says, “Ancestry feats. Class feats. General feats.”

Whirlpool says, “FEATSES”

Whirlpool says, “Yes.”

Malik says, “Archtype feats.”

Whirlpool nodnods.

Whirlpool says, “THere's a *lot*.”

Malik says, “All the feats.”

Whirlpool says, “And a lot of versatility between them.”

Whirlpool says, “It's great, especially for a MU*.”

Malik says, “You get one like, every level.”

Stjepan says, “It'll be nice to mess around with builds in advance, admittedly.”

Whirlpool says, “Yeah, I really like that my level 5 character will necessarily look different than someone else's. :D”

Whirlpool says, “Whereas in 5e that's... not so likely.”

Raethon DLs the app. :D

Merek takes a look at Oracle.

Ferrah nods at Whirlpool. "I was just about to say that."

Derecho says, “The Oracle, admittedly, is hardmode.”

Whirlpool says, “I mean setting aside the OGL issue with 5e, two vengeance paladins will play a lot alike.”

Merek says, “oh?”

Whirlpool says, “That won't be so true in PF2.”

Whirlpool yawns. Claps hands loudly once. Okay, folks.

Williwaw says, “Not vengeance. Punishment.”

Whirlpool says, “I've got some RL I need to tend to, so get your last questions in now. :)”

Whirlpool chomps Willikwaw. :P

Whirlpool F

Mikilos says, “Rent, day jobs?”

Whirlpool says, “Spoilers.”

Merek says, “Can we own places.”

Whirlpool says, “I mean, you can right now.”

Derecho says, “The Oracle's class features revolve around leveraging specific growing penalties with commensurate, usually related, benefits.”

Whirlpool says, “There's no reason to think that will change. :)”

Whirlpool says, “Now!”

You say, “Hold up, coder clarification incoming.”

Whirlpool holds up!

You say, “Ares has no concept of owning objects.”

Whirlpool says, “Yeah, that is also true.”

You say, “That said - you will be able to have a personal space that you can describe.”

You say, “Only builders can create and destroy rooms and exits.”

Malik says, “Not that you would need to.”

You say, “No.”

Whirlpool says, “There's going to be changes that will influence all that. :)”

Whirlpool says, “So ... spoilers. xD”

Malik says, “I can literally scene/start Alexandria/The Little Hidey Hole Under the Stairs in Mithralla Merchandise=Private”

Stjepan says, “Will the framework of transfer/retirement options be coming in advance of the change? If not the spoiler-specific bits?”

Whirlpool says, “Yes.”

Stjepan says, “Perfect.”

Whirlpool says, “Those bits will be revealed when they the story reaches that point and they're ready. :)”

Whirlpool says, “If you want to trasnsfer out the gate, you will be starting them at level 1. :)”

Whirlpool says, “There will be reasons behind that working.”

Whirlpool says, “Retirement options will be explained.”

Whirlpool says, “Last questions?”

Raethon says, “I have none....for now.”

Cryosanthia says, "I don't have any more right now."

Azog is good.

Elleandra ponders...

Stjepan thumbsups

Stjepan hands Elle the mic.

Elleandra says, “What excites you most about the change, Whirl?”

Whirlpool says, “The new storytelling opportunities, Elle.”

Merek says, “ty!”

Whirlpool says, “We've been hard at work on the theme updates and I'm really excited by them.”

Elleandra says, “Thank you :)”

Whirlpool says, “we're shaking a lot of things up.”

Elleandra says, “I'm looking forward to seeing what you are creating :)”

Stjepan nodnods.

Raethon looks forward to it, Whirl.

Azog farts around with https://rpgworkshop.app/pf2/character-builder

Aya did think of one last question, though it is more ARES/migration related than theme.

Aya says, “So perhaps this is best for Landslide: Will WhirlDice be transferred to Ares?"”

Derecho snrk.

Elleandra thinks that's spoilers~ lol

Landslide laughs. "It's hard to say. Ruby's RNG is very different."

Aya nods.

You say, “In truth, Whirldice is something of an urban legend, or a running gag, moreso than a true thing.”

Aya knows. "It still seemed a very relevant question."

You say, “Who can say if it will transfer? I think that you as players will find that that is up to you.”

Malik says, “From what I've seen on my little textbox project the dice tend to behave a bit better, but Land may have a different take.”

You say, “The RNG seems to be more random, yes,”

Whirlpool :(

Whirlpool shakes fist.

Whirlpool says, “Okay, I need to go help my dog. Page me if you have more concerns, folks.”